In a recent post someone cited a paragraph from the new pamplet from the church related to same gender attraction. The writer later said he felt it was poorly worded.
"[A]void any influence that can harm your spirituality. One of these adverse influences is obsession with or concentration on same-gender thoughts and feelings. It is not helpful to flaunt homosexual tendencies or make them the subject of unnecessary observation or discussion. It is better to choose as friends those who do not publicly display their homosexual feelings. The careful selection of friends and mentors who lead constructive, righteous lives is one of the most important steps to being productive and virtuous. Association with those of the same gender is natural and desirable, so long as you set wise boundaries to avoid improper and unhealthy emotional dependency, which may eventually result in physical and sexual intimacy. There is moral risk in having so close a relationship with one friend of the same gender that it may lead to vices the Lord has condemned. Our most important relationships are with our own families because our ties to them can be eternal."
I know that some may feel this was poorly written. I couldn't disagree with this more. I think it says what it needs to say period. It couldn't be any more blunt and to the point. I think the more we spend time reading the words and spending time around people who would encourage us to "fall away" to "be true to ourselves" the more and more we stand at risk at doing just that. I know in his heart these people are trying
to be good friends and trying to help us. But they are wrong. And yes I have many dear friends who consider themselves gay. Who think its great that I stay in the church. Because its "for me." But its not "for them." But I will also admit to a certain degree of sadness because if what I or any faithful member of the church believes "it's for all of us." I can only have faith and love them and not give up on them. But in the end unless they don't choose to change they are wrong and I hope in the final judgment God doesn't look to me and say, "why didn't you warn them?"
As for this this pamplet. It was approved by the First Presidency. Had it needed to be rewritten I think the Prophet would have seen to it.
This is one of the most pressing issues in the Church today. I also think this is an issue that weighs deeply on them. I also know this is an issue that they know they are being scrutinized over rather justly or unjustly. You only need to read some of the blogs that are only a link away on the Northern Lights Blog to get a healthy dose of this sort of loyal opposition.
I know our struggles cause them great pain and anguish. I also know that they know that any thing they say will be carefully scrutinized both within and outside the church by both the faithful, those looking for loop holes and those looking for further truth to add to their arsenal against the church. I would say that every comma and every period in this booklet was very carefully worded so as not to be taken anyway other then the intended meaning.
That's why I bristle with the references to "moho's" and "coming out" again I know that language and intent can be nuanced. But I don't think this was Elder Oaks intent, I do think he meant that we aren't to see ourselves as such less we start to think we are doomed to this with no hope.
I think that Satan is a great deceiver. He is able to mask sin under civil rights. I think he even is able to use God's greatest gift of agency to promote it and Christ's own words not to judge as a means to protect it. I think he is able to use some of our smartest men to then stand up and fight for the rights to condone it and accept it and villianize anyone who would stand against it.
No I don't condemn those who may think what I'm saying is wrong. They have their agency to think or believe whatever they want. I'm only going by what I believe and feel. The thing I think we need to remember is that Satan acts with full knowledge. We are react with limited knowledge and opinions fueled by our desires, logic and experiences. Satan can never be forgive for his rebellion because he knew exactly what he was doing. The thing is he already knows he's going to lose and if he can get us to fall even a little bit then we are just a sad consolation prize.
I think we are the ones who need to decide if we are going to have the faith to follow the council given.
Friday, March 7, 2008
Tuesday, February 26, 2008
Moho's and "ites" in the Church
I think we show our level of devotion to the gospel by how we take the council of our leaders. For some time now I've really had an issue with the self proclaimed title of "moho" and the way its used by some people to describe themselves and others who struggle with same gender attraction.
I also bristle when I hear people within the Church talk about "coming out."
And it really bothers me after the Brethren have warned over and over in interviews, pamphlets and articles about using the term gay to describe ourselves as people.
I think that the more we accept the worlds way of handling and describing our struggles the more we open ourselves up to Satan to attack us.
Elder Oaks taught: "I think it's important for you to understand that homosexuality, which you've spoken of, is not a noun that describes a condition. It's an adjective that describes feelings or behavior. I encourage you, as you struggle with these
In short the world would have it become the God we worship and base all our decisions on.
While I think many of us are trying to be faithful, I think that we also fall into this trap from time-to-time.
The Book of Mormon warns of "ites" but it seems like there has been a development, a subculture so to speak within the Church of LDS men who struggle who like to define themselves into this community.
Do we refer to other members of the Church who struggle with other problems with other names?
Part of it may be that we don't feel like we fit in and so we are trying to create a community for oursleves where we belong. I think this is very dangerous because with community's come cultures of their own. In the Kingdom of God there are no "ites."
Don't get me wrong. There I think the most important part of trying to be faithful is accepting a challenge as real. I do think that we do need to be honest with those people who do care about us if we feel its something that they can understand and help provide support to us as we strive to stay the course. But I don't see it as a "rite of passage" or a "declaration of independence and of who I really am." When you come
out of something it means to leave something. So if someone is choosing to be faithful, what are they really coming out of?
I also think sometimes, at least I know this is the case in my life that I may pray for something that I want to know or understand that is already pretty clearly explained but that I just don't like the answer so I keep praying hoping to get another answer that I can agree with. I'm not praying in faith. Its more like I have a deck of cards and I'm going to keep drawing a new card until I get the card I want.
If we allow Satan to win us, in a war that we already know he will lose in the end, and if we allow him to use our struggles to help us choose our path and what we are going to do, how we are going to refer to ourselves and what our relationship with the Lord will be, then we have already failed.
I don't want to sound preachy, but we know what is wrong and we know what is right. The Bretheran have been pretty clear about this. Its up to us to choose. No amount of debate or discussion will change basic gospel principles. Yes we need to love and accept and be tolerant. But we also need to have faith and realize that we may never know all the answers in this life. But if we are faithful and follow the
commandments we will one day be blessed with more happiness then we can ever imagine.
I also bristle when I hear people within the Church talk about "coming out."
And it really bothers me after the Brethren have warned over and over in interviews, pamphlets and articles about using the term gay to describe ourselves as people.
I think that the more we accept the worlds way of handling and describing our struggles the more we open ourselves up to Satan to attack us.
Elder Oaks taught: "I think it's important for you to understand that homosexuality, which you've spoken of, is not a noun that describes a condition. It's an adjective that describes feelings or behavior. I encourage you, as you struggle with these
In short the world would have it become the God we worship and base all our decisions on.
While I think many of us are trying to be faithful, I think that we also fall into this trap from time-to-time.
The Book of Mormon warns of "ites" but it seems like there has been a development, a subculture so to speak within the Church of LDS men who struggle who like to define themselves into this community.
Do we refer to other members of the Church who struggle with other problems with other names?
Part of it may be that we don't feel like we fit in and so we are trying to create a community for oursleves where we belong. I think this is very dangerous because with community's come cultures of their own. In the Kingdom of God there are no "ites."
Don't get me wrong. There I think the most important part of trying to be faithful is accepting a challenge as real. I do think that we do need to be honest with those people who do care about us if we feel its something that they can understand and help provide support to us as we strive to stay the course. But I don't see it as a "rite of passage" or a "declaration of independence and of who I really am." When you come
out of something it means to leave something. So if someone is choosing to be faithful, what are they really coming out of?
I also think sometimes, at least I know this is the case in my life that I may pray for something that I want to know or understand that is already pretty clearly explained but that I just don't like the answer so I keep praying hoping to get another answer that I can agree with. I'm not praying in faith. Its more like I have a deck of cards and I'm going to keep drawing a new card until I get the card I want.
If we allow Satan to win us, in a war that we already know he will lose in the end, and if we allow him to use our struggles to help us choose our path and what we are going to do, how we are going to refer to ourselves and what our relationship with the Lord will be, then we have already failed.
I don't want to sound preachy, but we know what is wrong and we know what is right. The Bretheran have been pretty clear about this. Its up to us to choose. No amount of debate or discussion will change basic gospel principles. Yes we need to love and accept and be tolerant. But we also need to have faith and realize that we may never know all the answers in this life. But if we are faithful and follow the
commandments we will one day be blessed with more happiness then we can ever imagine.
Sunday, February 24, 2008
The Rock
The past couple days there has been a lot of discussion on "coming out" or as I think it can be more appropriately put "being honest" or telling others for those of us who struggle but desire to be faithful.
A friend of mine posted something that I think is often overlooked.
.....One close friend cautioned me from telling others because she feels that every time I tell someone I reinforce the label, realigning myself with it as part of my identity......
Elder Oaks gave awesome council to us about not using an adjective that defines our struggle to describe ourselves. I recently told a friend who was debating "telling" to remember that the only real label we should assume is His name. Everything else that we define ourselves by should glorify that.
Sometimes we struggle with things that if we don't succeed we feel we have failed. There is a story about a man that the Lord gave a commandment to try to move this rock.
He spent years and years trying but even with his best efforts never moved the rock even an inch. Satan got wind of this and went to the man and said, "why don't you give up. You haven't moved the rock." Still the man didn't give up.
The man died having failed in his mind. He went to the Lord and asked "Why did you ask me to do something you knew couldn't be done?"
The Lord responded that He never ask him "to move" the rock just to "try."
"Look at yourself, look how your efforts have made you strong, my son you have been faithful and obedient in your efforts and that's what I asked you to do. Now I will move the rock."
I also know that God loves us and wants us to be happy, but I also know that love comes from bending our will to his. This may be our greatest challenge in life. Whatever our struggles are. God greatest blessings come in His time and we have to sometimes endure pain. We can't be guilty of asking God to bless us right now and not be willing to wait on His time. He will answer our prayers but in his own time. And that time is the time that is right for us. I have come to realize that. I learned that after I came to understand what "not my will but his will."
Pres Kimball said that if we look at life on Earth as the whole of existence then it is easy to lose hope. But when viewed in an eternal perspective, we see that these trials teach us. If God took all our trials from us we wouldn't have to live by faith and at the same time agency wouldn't be needed. Its only through our trials that we are able to use our agency to show God we love him enough to choose his will over our own.
Alma wished he could speak with the tongue of an angel but he realized he was just a man. So are we. We are blessed by our obedience and faithfulness and like in the story as long as we are willing to put the effort into moving the rock God promises to do the rest.
A friend of mine posted something that I think is often overlooked.
.....One close friend cautioned me from telling others because she feels that every time I tell someone I reinforce the label, realigning myself with it as part of my identity......
Elder Oaks gave awesome council to us about not using an adjective that defines our struggle to describe ourselves. I recently told a friend who was debating "telling" to remember that the only real label we should assume is His name. Everything else that we define ourselves by should glorify that.
Sometimes we struggle with things that if we don't succeed we feel we have failed. There is a story about a man that the Lord gave a commandment to try to move this rock.
He spent years and years trying but even with his best efforts never moved the rock even an inch. Satan got wind of this and went to the man and said, "why don't you give up. You haven't moved the rock." Still the man didn't give up.
The man died having failed in his mind. He went to the Lord and asked "Why did you ask me to do something you knew couldn't be done?"
The Lord responded that He never ask him "to move" the rock just to "try."
"Look at yourself, look how your efforts have made you strong, my son you have been faithful and obedient in your efforts and that's what I asked you to do. Now I will move the rock."
I also know that God loves us and wants us to be happy, but I also know that love comes from bending our will to his. This may be our greatest challenge in life. Whatever our struggles are. God greatest blessings come in His time and we have to sometimes endure pain. We can't be guilty of asking God to bless us right now and not be willing to wait on His time. He will answer our prayers but in his own time. And that time is the time that is right for us. I have come to realize that. I learned that after I came to understand what "not my will but his will."
Pres Kimball said that if we look at life on Earth as the whole of existence then it is easy to lose hope. But when viewed in an eternal perspective, we see that these trials teach us. If God took all our trials from us we wouldn't have to live by faith and at the same time agency wouldn't be needed. Its only through our trials that we are able to use our agency to show God we love him enough to choose his will over our own.
Alma wished he could speak with the tongue of an angel but he realized he was just a man. So are we. We are blessed by our obedience and faithfulness and like in the story as long as we are willing to put the effort into moving the rock God promises to do the rest.
Monday, February 18, 2008
Modar
I shared this with a friend in his blog, but I wanted to share it here because I know it fits.
I don't know why we are attracted to some people and not others. I found when I was on my mission that I was prompted to talk to some people more then others. I also know there have been times when I feel the Lord knows I'm stuburn and uses my struggle as a means to direct me to people who I need to know. I don't know. I guess if I keep close to the Spirit and pray for guidance that I can't really go wrong if I'm suddenly "attracted to someone." If my intentions are pure and I am trying to do whats right I can't go wrong.
However I do know that God won't use bad things to inspire us or put us into situations where we could fall in order to save another person. He loves us all equally. We know our own strengths and weaknesses and should challenge them. But I also know he does sometimes send angels in the form of regular everyday heroes.
I went to a party once with a friend. while I was there a lot of stuff started to happen that was really wrong. First someone put on a movie that was bad and then some of the people begin to pair off and make out yes there were a lot of gay people there and whatnot. I felt uncomfortable. I didn't want to leave because I didn't want to offend my friend, but at the same time I really didn't want to be there.
There was this one guy who I had been watching all night who didn't look like he fit in. He had come with a group of girls and was sitting in the corner of the room. I kept looking at him and noticed that he was at times looking at me. And yes he was attractive. And yes I was drawn to him. But I resisted that urge.
So I went out on the balcony. While I was there the guy followed me out.
He said "hey I noticed you seemed uncomfortable in there," I nodded, it was cold. We were both shivering and you could see our breath.
He said "so did I, I don't know any of those people and thats not really what I believe." He then said "I've been watching you all night and I was wondering why someone like you were here." I told him it was funny because I thought the same thing.
I said I was there because my friend had been in the cast of the play and I was his ride and I was supporting him.
We talked some more and he asked me outright "Are you gay?" I didn't think about it and said, "No I'm Mormon."
He looked stunned and said, "OMG so am I."
I think we both thought the same thing right then because while we both smiled at each other we stood out there in the cold for a few minutes not saying anything.
We both realized that it wasn't so much attraction that made us single each other out. It was that we both had "Modar" that "Mormon Glow" so-to-speak. He said he hadn't been to church since he moved out here but that he missed it. He said he still read the scriptures his mom gave him. He said he had done stuff and felt that he wouldn't be accepted, but that he had prayed every night and hoped to find a friend who would understand.
Yes we do stand out even when we may want to blend in. When we start not to thats when we need to really think about if we are on the right path.
We stayed friends, he moved back to where he was from a few months later. But that night we both probably saved each other from making some stupid mistakes.
I've had this expirence a number of times since than and I think it's proof that the Lord does watch out for us when we let him and sometimes when we don't think he's watching.
I don't know why we are attracted to some people and not others. I found when I was on my mission that I was prompted to talk to some people more then others. I also know there have been times when I feel the Lord knows I'm stuburn and uses my struggle as a means to direct me to people who I need to know. I don't know. I guess if I keep close to the Spirit and pray for guidance that I can't really go wrong if I'm suddenly "attracted to someone." If my intentions are pure and I am trying to do whats right I can't go wrong.
However I do know that God won't use bad things to inspire us or put us into situations where we could fall in order to save another person. He loves us all equally. We know our own strengths and weaknesses and should challenge them. But I also know he does sometimes send angels in the form of regular everyday heroes.
I went to a party once with a friend. while I was there a lot of stuff started to happen that was really wrong. First someone put on a movie that was bad and then some of the people begin to pair off and make out yes there were a lot of gay people there and whatnot. I felt uncomfortable. I didn't want to leave because I didn't want to offend my friend, but at the same time I really didn't want to be there.
There was this one guy who I had been watching all night who didn't look like he fit in. He had come with a group of girls and was sitting in the corner of the room. I kept looking at him and noticed that he was at times looking at me. And yes he was attractive. And yes I was drawn to him. But I resisted that urge.
So I went out on the balcony. While I was there the guy followed me out.
He said "hey I noticed you seemed uncomfortable in there," I nodded, it was cold. We were both shivering and you could see our breath.
He said "so did I, I don't know any of those people and thats not really what I believe." He then said "I've been watching you all night and I was wondering why someone like you were here." I told him it was funny because I thought the same thing.
I said I was there because my friend had been in the cast of the play and I was his ride and I was supporting him.
We talked some more and he asked me outright "Are you gay?" I didn't think about it and said, "No I'm Mormon."
He looked stunned and said, "OMG so am I."
I think we both thought the same thing right then because while we both smiled at each other we stood out there in the cold for a few minutes not saying anything.
We both realized that it wasn't so much attraction that made us single each other out. It was that we both had "Modar" that "Mormon Glow" so-to-speak. He said he hadn't been to church since he moved out here but that he missed it. He said he still read the scriptures his mom gave him. He said he had done stuff and felt that he wouldn't be accepted, but that he had prayed every night and hoped to find a friend who would understand.
Yes we do stand out even when we may want to blend in. When we start not to thats when we need to really think about if we are on the right path.
We stayed friends, he moved back to where he was from a few months later. But that night we both probably saved each other from making some stupid mistakes.
I've had this expirence a number of times since than and I think it's proof that the Lord does watch out for us when we let him and sometimes when we don't think he's watching.
Tuesday, February 5, 2008
Perceptions - Respect vs. Acceptance
It's good to be tolerant of other people and their different opinions and beliefs.
In certain cases we know what is clearly the gospel outlook on an issue and what isn't. Either we know from what we have been taught or the spirit prompts us.
When we have a friend who uses their agency to follow a path that is clearly the wrong way, we can love them and even support them in a way that isn't condemning them.
But respecting other opinions isn't the same as accepting them.
Pres Monson addressed this on Monday when Peggy Strack asked if a member of the church can disagree with a church position (same gender marriage in this case) and stay in good standing. He said that it depends on what the position is and if it is apostacy.
Sadly there are times that no matter how hard we try to be accepting, the perception our friends have of us may be a reflection of our true beliefs. Some people will only accept us if we agree with them. We may try to reach out but sometimes for instance if we say "we love you," then vote for things like the marriage amendment, our efforts may be viewed as hypocrisy. Their view of us is based more on how the person feels about what we think and less on what we believe even if we haven't expressed it. In the end we do have to stand for what we believe.
There have been a lot of times when I've honesty tried, but have been told point blank "you say you accept me but there is no way you can be Mormon and believe that way and still accept me as a friend."
Ironically it is normally only Latter-day Saints who are struggling who say that. I think its because they know in their hearts what is true.
On the other hand I think its also possible in our attempts to be tolerant to go too far in the other direction and be confused with acceptance. True we need to accept our brothers and sisters, but if they are doing things we know are wrong then we need to be honest with them - if we are asked.
If we know we are weak ourselves we need to be careful of the influences we allow in our lives. Further if their actions encourage or normalize what would lead us to make a bad choice in our own lives we may need to step back.
I'm reminded of my friends mother's advice when she found out we were hanging out with some people who weren't making the best choices.
"You can be good friends, you may be the only example of a good choice they have. Just be careful it is you who is setting the example and not the other way around. Don't be led to places where you know that the Spirit isn't in your attempts to help them."
Yes there are different opinions and yes there is truth. There is also falsehoods that can comfort us into apostacy. And yes Satan is good at blurring "feeling" good with a spiritual confirmation if in our hearts we desire what is wrong.
It is sometimes easy to accept this as personal revelation and then accept it as truth. Worse if the person shares this with others who are struggling and they follow them than their is a real danger of becoming a false prophet even if our intentions are good.
They key here is that God will never guide us counter to His revealed truths. Personal revelation will only provide us with personal ways to follow the right path, not pave another.
There are also many different ways to follow the correct path and we need to be open to it and not stand as a roadblock to others who are on the right path. We also need to be careful that we don't confuse the ideas of man to be these routes and again the Spirit will serve as a guide to us if we are open to it.
In certain cases we know what is clearly the gospel outlook on an issue and what isn't. Either we know from what we have been taught or the spirit prompts us.
When we have a friend who uses their agency to follow a path that is clearly the wrong way, we can love them and even support them in a way that isn't condemning them.
But respecting other opinions isn't the same as accepting them.
Pres Monson addressed this on Monday when Peggy Strack asked if a member of the church can disagree with a church position (same gender marriage in this case) and stay in good standing. He said that it depends on what the position is and if it is apostacy.
Sadly there are times that no matter how hard we try to be accepting, the perception our friends have of us may be a reflection of our true beliefs. Some people will only accept us if we agree with them. We may try to reach out but sometimes for instance if we say "we love you," then vote for things like the marriage amendment, our efforts may be viewed as hypocrisy. Their view of us is based more on how the person feels about what we think and less on what we believe even if we haven't expressed it. In the end we do have to stand for what we believe.
There have been a lot of times when I've honesty tried, but have been told point blank "you say you accept me but there is no way you can be Mormon and believe that way and still accept me as a friend."
Ironically it is normally only Latter-day Saints who are struggling who say that. I think its because they know in their hearts what is true.
On the other hand I think its also possible in our attempts to be tolerant to go too far in the other direction and be confused with acceptance. True we need to accept our brothers and sisters, but if they are doing things we know are wrong then we need to be honest with them - if we are asked.
If we know we are weak ourselves we need to be careful of the influences we allow in our lives. Further if their actions encourage or normalize what would lead us to make a bad choice in our own lives we may need to step back.
I'm reminded of my friends mother's advice when she found out we were hanging out with some people who weren't making the best choices.
"You can be good friends, you may be the only example of a good choice they have. Just be careful it is you who is setting the example and not the other way around. Don't be led to places where you know that the Spirit isn't in your attempts to help them."
Yes there are different opinions and yes there is truth. There is also falsehoods that can comfort us into apostacy. And yes Satan is good at blurring "feeling" good with a spiritual confirmation if in our hearts we desire what is wrong.
It is sometimes easy to accept this as personal revelation and then accept it as truth. Worse if the person shares this with others who are struggling and they follow them than their is a real danger of becoming a false prophet even if our intentions are good.
They key here is that God will never guide us counter to His revealed truths. Personal revelation will only provide us with personal ways to follow the right path, not pave another.
There are also many different ways to follow the correct path and we need to be open to it and not stand as a roadblock to others who are on the right path. We also need to be careful that we don't confuse the ideas of man to be these routes and again the Spirit will serve as a guide to us if we are open to it.
Monday, January 21, 2008
Dwelling with Saints
I wrote this as a letter to a friend who was struggling with being faithful, fitting in and finding out that we are all, even Mormons human.
Brigham Young once said, “To dwell with the Saints in Zion, oh what a glory, to live with them on the Earth, that’s another story.”
I know how much it hurts when you are treated badly by people who know better. Not just “should know better.” I would think, as much time as we spend in sacrament and testimony meetings, tearfully testifying our love for everyone in the room that we really mean it. At times I think we say it not so much because we do love everyone, but because we are taught Christ loves everyone and since we are trying to be like Him, we also say we love everyone to feel like we are being like Him.
Nothing hurts more then when we go to Church, the one place where we should feel loved and accepted. And find we don’t. Even worse when we feel rejected because we struggle with something that makes us feel like we aren’t worthy and that something isn’t something we choose to feel. It hurts even worse when we find those who struggle reject us.
One thing Latter-day Saints have in common with the rest of the world is that we are human. In the context of the Church we have a culture fueled by the quest for perfection. In the gay culture perfection is also a goal. In the Church we try to be perfect, meaning complete. This is often misinterpreted as doing everything right and “looking good” while we do it. In the gay culture perfect means without blemish, young, and thin. One should be a refinement of spiritual things and the other is a standard based on worldly criteria. Both are concepts of perfection, and both really unreachable goals to some extent and both a harsh ruler to judge one self by.
I have also found that while a lot of LDS SGA guys may strive to “live the gospel” this often only translates to “not acting out” it doesn’t mean that they don’t avoid the traits or actions that are prevalent in the gay culture. It just means that they avoid going far enough that their actions are considered sins or simply put, that they have to see the bishop.
I also know that what determines if a guy is too needy or clingy most of the time has more to do with what the person who is the object of the attention feels about the person. If the guy who is trying to be friends is attractive then a lot of times this extra measure and desire for friendship is welcome. “Wow the cute guy who is struggling need my help and support.” However if the guy isn’t, they are often branded as being “too needy” or “two clingy.” It’s funny how a person’s worthiness of love or attention and even support can so easily be based on their appearance. I guess we can say jokingly ask “how gay is that?” But honestly, how gay IS that? When the cute guys fall we excuse them, and are ready to make concessions for them, its “he’s not a bad person, he’s just made a mistake.” If he isn’t attractive to us it becomes, “He’s crazy stalker.”
Being one of those guys who fall into the less then perfect category, I’ve felt this kind of judgment first hand at LDS gatherings. I’ve felt ignored and sometimes worse included only because someone its “trying to be Christlike” to me by including me in their otherwise very select group. And when I tried to move further along or form some real friendships it was quickly made clear to me that I was overstepping the kindness being granted to me by those who deemed themselves more worthy then me because of their perceptions of me. And yes you don’t find out about this directly, you read about it in a blog or you call a number given to you that turn out to be a fake one. Or someone accidentally lets it slip what someone really thinks about you or a friend just stops talking to you when they find out another more attractive friend of theirs sees you as less than worthy.
But I’ve also have had to come to the conclusion that I can’t confuse feeling accepted by members of the Church with me being accepted by God. The gospel is true. The church is true. Jesus is the Christ and he won’t reject me and he doesn’t care what I look like.
Brandon, the plain truth here is simple. If you read anything in this post read and remember this. His atonement is as effective for me at 260 pounds as it is for the cute guy with the faux hock and Hollister hoodie. God loves you as much as he does the guy with the blonde highlights and the A&F t-shirt. He listens to your prayers as much as he does anyone else even if you don’t go to the gym everyday.
It’s hard because yes, we all wanted to be loved and needed. We all want to be desirable. And yes we all are trying to be faithful and none of us want to think we are motivated by anything other then pure intentions when it comes to our interactions with others BUT we are all guilty of it. There are times when I found myself not happy with the friends I did have who did like me and wanted to know why those other guys don’t like me. In so doing I forgot the ones who did. There are people who no matter how hard we try do annoy us. And there are people that no matter how much we try we may not really care for. Do I think that we are better people if we try to work through those feelings to find good in them? Yes. But I think for the most part, we need to first find the better part of ourselves before we try to do that in others because the way we treat people and who we accept is a reflection of what we often desire for ourselves.
But regardless of how others may or may not accept us has nothing to do with the Church being true. Its more a matter of us being true to the things the Church has taught us. Its like a math problem, the answer is the same and correct but those doing it may be doing the math wrong. It doesn’t change the answer or make it incorrect. Remember that.
Some of these issues are issues that others may have that are really symptoms of their own struggles, they may crave being accepted by others who make them feel loved because they are “normal” or they “fit it.” Some crave having “attractive” people around them because they feel insecure if they don’t. They want to feel pretty and lets face it “pretty is as pretty does.” Just love and forgive. But if you do choose to love and forgive. Love for real and forgive for real. Don’t just do it to be like Jesus, do it because you do love them and you do forgive them otherwise its just as fake and phony.
There has been some good advice posted here by other people as well. Consider it, ponder it, and pray about it. In the end the only person you will ever need to be accepted by already accepts you. Now its just a matter of showing your love to him by being obedient to him and his commandments and yes forgiving those people. Never ever let those who should know better be the ones who help you determine how you spend the eternities by leaving because they don’t accept you. Don’t give them that kind of power over you. Shine on, be yourself and be who you are. Your real friends will see it and love you for it and you won’t have to be anything but who you really are. Just be you.
Brigham Young once said, “To dwell with the Saints in Zion, oh what a glory, to live with them on the Earth, that’s another story.”
I know how much it hurts when you are treated badly by people who know better. Not just “should know better.” I would think, as much time as we spend in sacrament and testimony meetings, tearfully testifying our love for everyone in the room that we really mean it. At times I think we say it not so much because we do love everyone, but because we are taught Christ loves everyone and since we are trying to be like Him, we also say we love everyone to feel like we are being like Him.
Nothing hurts more then when we go to Church, the one place where we should feel loved and accepted. And find we don’t. Even worse when we feel rejected because we struggle with something that makes us feel like we aren’t worthy and that something isn’t something we choose to feel. It hurts even worse when we find those who struggle reject us.
One thing Latter-day Saints have in common with the rest of the world is that we are human. In the context of the Church we have a culture fueled by the quest for perfection. In the gay culture perfection is also a goal. In the Church we try to be perfect, meaning complete. This is often misinterpreted as doing everything right and “looking good” while we do it. In the gay culture perfect means without blemish, young, and thin. One should be a refinement of spiritual things and the other is a standard based on worldly criteria. Both are concepts of perfection, and both really unreachable goals to some extent and both a harsh ruler to judge one self by.
I have also found that while a lot of LDS SGA guys may strive to “live the gospel” this often only translates to “not acting out” it doesn’t mean that they don’t avoid the traits or actions that are prevalent in the gay culture. It just means that they avoid going far enough that their actions are considered sins or simply put, that they have to see the bishop.
I also know that what determines if a guy is too needy or clingy most of the time has more to do with what the person who is the object of the attention feels about the person. If the guy who is trying to be friends is attractive then a lot of times this extra measure and desire for friendship is welcome. “Wow the cute guy who is struggling need my help and support.” However if the guy isn’t, they are often branded as being “too needy” or “two clingy.” It’s funny how a person’s worthiness of love or attention and even support can so easily be based on their appearance. I guess we can say jokingly ask “how gay is that?” But honestly, how gay IS that? When the cute guys fall we excuse them, and are ready to make concessions for them, its “he’s not a bad person, he’s just made a mistake.” If he isn’t attractive to us it becomes, “He’s crazy stalker.”
Being one of those guys who fall into the less then perfect category, I’ve felt this kind of judgment first hand at LDS gatherings. I’ve felt ignored and sometimes worse included only because someone its “trying to be Christlike” to me by including me in their otherwise very select group. And when I tried to move further along or form some real friendships it was quickly made clear to me that I was overstepping the kindness being granted to me by those who deemed themselves more worthy then me because of their perceptions of me. And yes you don’t find out about this directly, you read about it in a blog or you call a number given to you that turn out to be a fake one. Or someone accidentally lets it slip what someone really thinks about you or a friend just stops talking to you when they find out another more attractive friend of theirs sees you as less than worthy.
But I’ve also have had to come to the conclusion that I can’t confuse feeling accepted by members of the Church with me being accepted by God. The gospel is true. The church is true. Jesus is the Christ and he won’t reject me and he doesn’t care what I look like.
Brandon, the plain truth here is simple. If you read anything in this post read and remember this. His atonement is as effective for me at 260 pounds as it is for the cute guy with the faux hock and Hollister hoodie. God loves you as much as he does the guy with the blonde highlights and the A&F t-shirt. He listens to your prayers as much as he does anyone else even if you don’t go to the gym everyday.
It’s hard because yes, we all wanted to be loved and needed. We all want to be desirable. And yes we all are trying to be faithful and none of us want to think we are motivated by anything other then pure intentions when it comes to our interactions with others BUT we are all guilty of it. There are times when I found myself not happy with the friends I did have who did like me and wanted to know why those other guys don’t like me. In so doing I forgot the ones who did. There are people who no matter how hard we try do annoy us. And there are people that no matter how much we try we may not really care for. Do I think that we are better people if we try to work through those feelings to find good in them? Yes. But I think for the most part, we need to first find the better part of ourselves before we try to do that in others because the way we treat people and who we accept is a reflection of what we often desire for ourselves.
But regardless of how others may or may not accept us has nothing to do with the Church being true. Its more a matter of us being true to the things the Church has taught us. Its like a math problem, the answer is the same and correct but those doing it may be doing the math wrong. It doesn’t change the answer or make it incorrect. Remember that.
Some of these issues are issues that others may have that are really symptoms of their own struggles, they may crave being accepted by others who make them feel loved because they are “normal” or they “fit it.” Some crave having “attractive” people around them because they feel insecure if they don’t. They want to feel pretty and lets face it “pretty is as pretty does.” Just love and forgive. But if you do choose to love and forgive. Love for real and forgive for real. Don’t just do it to be like Jesus, do it because you do love them and you do forgive them otherwise its just as fake and phony.
There has been some good advice posted here by other people as well. Consider it, ponder it, and pray about it. In the end the only person you will ever need to be accepted by already accepts you. Now its just a matter of showing your love to him by being obedient to him and his commandments and yes forgiving those people. Never ever let those who should know better be the ones who help you determine how you spend the eternities by leaving because they don’t accept you. Don’t give them that kind of power over you. Shine on, be yourself and be who you are. Your real friends will see it and love you for it and you won’t have to be anything but who you really are. Just be you.
Saturday, December 15, 2007
Reflections on The Prodigal Son
I think that the wonderful thing about parables and why they are such great teaching tools are that they can apply at several different levels. "The Prodigal Son" is one of those examples.
In talking about this I'm referring to the scripture (Luke 11-32) and not the movie, which is a good variation, even if I still get irritated with the wife every time I watch it. I know she is right, but she could be more compassionate her own self, (but that's a whole other story.) This is a reference to a movie the church once made.
I think the important thing to remember is that while the story talks of hope, redemption and love, it also talks about the importance of being diligent, obedient and faithful.
When the second son took his portion early on and took it with him into the world and ended up hanging with swine,"(V:13), I think what Christ is referring to is to those who have the gospel and the knowledge given to them without much work on their own, i.e. "goods that falleth to me," and who then take what they have and go out and live like the rest of the world does.
I think this has a lot to do with our own personal conversions. Yes, some of us can be born in the church, even go on a mission and still not really understand it enough to realize that it's not a treasure unless we apply it to our lives.
I also think that part of the redemption aspect is that they know that they can come back and fix things if they desire to.(v.17 and 18) I truly feel that those people who truly have and understand the gospel, even if they are tempted, won't because they understand what they have. That doesn't mean they aren't tempted and that they don't sometimes make mistakes.
It is interesting to point out that when the son goes to the world for help after he starts to want (v. 14) the world doesn't help him, they send him to the fields to dwell with swine (v. 15) this could very well tell us what the value the real world places on us and make us think twice about wanting to be part of it. How much of this is seen in the world, once someone has fallen out of what is considered to be what is "in" at the time.
As for a second class reward. Remember that what the two sons started with are portions. Not rewards.
They had to do something with what they had to make it a reward. I think that part of the reward for obedience early on is that you don't have to go through all the "swine" parts to find out that what you had is really your treasure that you squandered if you did hang with pigs so to speak. And please don't take this to be a judgment of pigs, we are all sinners, but in avoiding sin sometimes it's important to avoid those who would encourage us to sin.
The treasure is only treasure if it's applied to our life. The gospel doesn't mean anything if it's knowledge that isn't acted on. That doesn't mean you won't be rewarded if you come back, but it also doesn't mean you won't have to accept that you also lost something as a result of your decisions. (V. 17) And the fatted calf can go about it's life and not killed. I think the poor bovine is the real victim in this tale.
When the other son came back and saw what was going on his pride overcame him as it does with a lot of people including myself at times. Sometimes I think this is natural frustration because its like having to watch someone you love suffer needlessly because they know the truth but don't want to accept it. That too is pride. You know the whole, "You have no right to judge me," mentality. I think that's has to be one of the most often over used scriptures and misunderstood scriptures, what I think is really amusing and yes, tragic, is the next part about "go and sin no more is never remembered by the one using it to defend their actions.
Sometimes when a person is trying it is viewed by those who are aren't as self rightness, because I think they resent the fact that they see happiness. But yes, I also think the older brother indignation gets the best of him and yes, a sin on the older brothers part, but lets have a little compassion for him also. He is trying.
I think what the father meant when he told the other son that "Son, thu art ever with me, and all that I have is thine," (v.31) means that he will earn his reward for "Sticking to it." Also that he already understands that his reward is that he didn't have to learn it the hard way. Meaning that yes, their are greater rewards for obedience, just as there are different levels in the kingdom of God. It doesn't mean God loves someone less, but we get what we deserve.
And yes sometimes that means while we are "out wasting our substance with riotous living," (V. 13) and then discover the world is actually in some kind of feminine (14)or moral decay and the goods part of the returning process is the revelation that we had are what protects us from having to suffer through this to begin with. I think this is why we have agency. The tragic part is when someone who has this gift don't realize that the gift is that he doesn't has to go suffer through life on his own and if he really understood it that in living the gospel, he will be happy instead of trying to make his own happiness and finding self produced happiness to really be of little real value, "And he would fain to fill his belly with the husks that the swine did eat." (V. 16.)
I do believe we have to learn things on our own in order for it to mean something to us. And maybe the years in the world can do this, but I think it is also far better to not have to go through this by "Sticking to it" to begin with. One of the first sons rewards was that he didn't have to go through the process of losing something in order to discover he had it to begin with and who knows what kinds of opportunities were lost during the second sons adventures in riotous living.
If this is the case in someones life, I hope that they will use this lesson and realize that they need the gospel and come back to it before it's too late.
Yes, the father was overjoyed that his other son had come home, enough to kill the calf and throw a party complete with "musick and neck kissing," just as Heavenly Father rejoices when one of us returns to the fold so to speak. But I think he is even more happy when we don't leave to begin with.
I think the problem is that sometimes we look at parables for more then what they are. They aren't the complete picture, I think they also are adaptable to a lot of situations and sometimes when certain parts are emphasized over other parts they may be used to emphasize something that really isn't there. I don't think this parable means that sinners who repent are going to get a second class reward any more then it means that sinners who repent will get the same as those who never sin to begin with. This is a story about how a father is happy when his son returns and how he welcomes him back and celebrates his return. Both sons started with the same reward, it was up to the individuals to decide what to do with it in order for it to become anything. God is just happy when we are near him.
I do think we have to admit to ourselves if we do wrong that, yes, because of what we do we may not deserve "All that is thine," but maybe we aren't ready for it and haven't spent our whole life preparing for it by by being "forever with me."
The key though is that the atonement makes up for a lot of mistakes when we accept it. We are all saved so to speak, that's mercy. Our actions dictate what happens after that, that's justice.
Everything we need to return to our Father is found within and living the Gospel of Jesus Christ. I think it's just a matter of accepting and living it.
In talking about this I'm referring to the scripture (Luke 11-32) and not the movie, which is a good variation, even if I still get irritated with the wife every time I watch it. I know she is right, but she could be more compassionate her own self, (but that's a whole other story.) This is a reference to a movie the church once made.
I think the important thing to remember is that while the story talks of hope, redemption and love, it also talks about the importance of being diligent, obedient and faithful.
When the second son took his portion early on and took it with him into the world and ended up hanging with swine,"(V:13), I think what Christ is referring to is to those who have the gospel and the knowledge given to them without much work on their own, i.e. "goods that falleth to me," and who then take what they have and go out and live like the rest of the world does.
I think this has a lot to do with our own personal conversions. Yes, some of us can be born in the church, even go on a mission and still not really understand it enough to realize that it's not a treasure unless we apply it to our lives.
I also think that part of the redemption aspect is that they know that they can come back and fix things if they desire to.(v.17 and 18) I truly feel that those people who truly have and understand the gospel, even if they are tempted, won't because they understand what they have. That doesn't mean they aren't tempted and that they don't sometimes make mistakes.
It is interesting to point out that when the son goes to the world for help after he starts to want (v. 14) the world doesn't help him, they send him to the fields to dwell with swine (v. 15) this could very well tell us what the value the real world places on us and make us think twice about wanting to be part of it. How much of this is seen in the world, once someone has fallen out of what is considered to be what is "in" at the time.
As for a second class reward. Remember that what the two sons started with are portions. Not rewards.
They had to do something with what they had to make it a reward. I think that part of the reward for obedience early on is that you don't have to go through all the "swine" parts to find out that what you had is really your treasure that you squandered if you did hang with pigs so to speak. And please don't take this to be a judgment of pigs, we are all sinners, but in avoiding sin sometimes it's important to avoid those who would encourage us to sin.
The treasure is only treasure if it's applied to our life. The gospel doesn't mean anything if it's knowledge that isn't acted on. That doesn't mean you won't be rewarded if you come back, but it also doesn't mean you won't have to accept that you also lost something as a result of your decisions. (V. 17) And the fatted calf can go about it's life and not killed. I think the poor bovine is the real victim in this tale.
When the other son came back and saw what was going on his pride overcame him as it does with a lot of people including myself at times. Sometimes I think this is natural frustration because its like having to watch someone you love suffer needlessly because they know the truth but don't want to accept it. That too is pride. You know the whole, "You have no right to judge me," mentality. I think that's has to be one of the most often over used scriptures and misunderstood scriptures, what I think is really amusing and yes, tragic, is the next part about "go and sin no more is never remembered by the one using it to defend their actions.
Sometimes when a person is trying it is viewed by those who are aren't as self rightness, because I think they resent the fact that they see happiness. But yes, I also think the older brother indignation gets the best of him and yes, a sin on the older brothers part, but lets have a little compassion for him also. He is trying.
I think what the father meant when he told the other son that "Son, thu art ever with me, and all that I have is thine," (v.31) means that he will earn his reward for "Sticking to it." Also that he already understands that his reward is that he didn't have to learn it the hard way. Meaning that yes, their are greater rewards for obedience, just as there are different levels in the kingdom of God. It doesn't mean God loves someone less, but we get what we deserve.
And yes sometimes that means while we are "out wasting our substance with riotous living," (V. 13) and then discover the world is actually in some kind of feminine (14)or moral decay and the goods part of the returning process is the revelation that we had are what protects us from having to suffer through this to begin with. I think this is why we have agency. The tragic part is when someone who has this gift don't realize that the gift is that he doesn't has to go suffer through life on his own and if he really understood it that in living the gospel, he will be happy instead of trying to make his own happiness and finding self produced happiness to really be of little real value, "And he would fain to fill his belly with the husks that the swine did eat." (V. 16.)
I do believe we have to learn things on our own in order for it to mean something to us. And maybe the years in the world can do this, but I think it is also far better to not have to go through this by "Sticking to it" to begin with. One of the first sons rewards was that he didn't have to go through the process of losing something in order to discover he had it to begin with and who knows what kinds of opportunities were lost during the second sons adventures in riotous living.
If this is the case in someones life, I hope that they will use this lesson and realize that they need the gospel and come back to it before it's too late.
Yes, the father was overjoyed that his other son had come home, enough to kill the calf and throw a party complete with "musick and neck kissing," just as Heavenly Father rejoices when one of us returns to the fold so to speak. But I think he is even more happy when we don't leave to begin with.
I think the problem is that sometimes we look at parables for more then what they are. They aren't the complete picture, I think they also are adaptable to a lot of situations and sometimes when certain parts are emphasized over other parts they may be used to emphasize something that really isn't there. I don't think this parable means that sinners who repent are going to get a second class reward any more then it means that sinners who repent will get the same as those who never sin to begin with. This is a story about how a father is happy when his son returns and how he welcomes him back and celebrates his return. Both sons started with the same reward, it was up to the individuals to decide what to do with it in order for it to become anything. God is just happy when we are near him.
I do think we have to admit to ourselves if we do wrong that, yes, because of what we do we may not deserve "All that is thine," but maybe we aren't ready for it and haven't spent our whole life preparing for it by by being "forever with me."
The key though is that the atonement makes up for a lot of mistakes when we accept it. We are all saved so to speak, that's mercy. Our actions dictate what happens after that, that's justice.
Everything we need to return to our Father is found within and living the Gospel of Jesus Christ. I think it's just a matter of accepting and living it.
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